Watch this! Why do people say Tai Chi and Ba-Gua are not effective??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UPg1tb6p...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8qv6TldA...

I thought it was OK! The actions of the opponent were about as fast as someone in the street with no or little training. The soft arts are not taught to the military, not because they are not effective but because they take too long to learn within the context of training time allotted.

Because its boring, I couldn't even pull it up. That's why.

.Looks cool. There may be some effective techniques, but you can't use that video to prove effectiveness. That was an instructor fighting one of his students in a demonstration. Even in that environment it didn't look particularly dangerous.. If your going to prove "real world effectiveness" it needs to be done in a more "real world" environment. It might as well have been an episode of the power rangers.

i think every martial art can be effective if the practitioner is skilled in it...these videos are training drills and demos so the "bad guy" is playing along with the the man doing the techniques....making it look easier than it really would be on the street!! However, i think anyone would have a challenge going up against a calm headed martial artist like the one in those you tube video..

i wish people would just appreciate every type of martial art and see what each one has to offer.

to me they are all cool! i wish that i had enough time to be effective in all of them....

thanks for your question

many people dont knwo that there is a combat form of tai chi thats why as for ba gua ive never heard anyone say its ineffective

because no armies, police forces, jails, professional fighters anywhere in the world use them.

Even the countries who invented them don't recommend them for fighting, police action or self defence.

Is that a good enough reason?

Both are very effective,you will have septics no matter what you can prove,don't sweat it.

This is all choreographed. It's just another version of wire fu. I'll believe it when I see a Tai Chi "fighter" win in actual combat, or at least in a sport match.

Posting a video of a highly stylized and choreographed routine is not going to change anyones mind. The "attacker" was not really attacking, just feeding.

How about a video of a tai chi guy actually fighting in a competitive format?

Even though these videos are taken from a demostrative aspect, one can see how these arts can be effectively applied to self defense situations. Open palm strikes to the solar plexus and elbows to the chest could easily be focused on other targets like the throat and face. The people that diss this aparently have no imaginative means of seeing where techniques can be altered to deliver more harmful strikes. As far as K-1 and all those other "combat" sports go, you won't find anyone that sticks to a single pugilistic style because they are MMA sports. There are tai chi / bagua principles that could be applied and maybe even some techniques but you won't last long without grappling experience. My teacher studied Hsing-I along with Shotokan and Judo and he applied many of the things he learned from all three while on tours during the Vietnam war. In and of themselves, it is probably safe to say that they are not effective combat arts. Combine the techniques with the right mentality and you have a fairly deadly person on your hands.

I am not disparaging this style in general. But if you are trying to show how combat effective this art is you need to find something better than those videos. None of that was done in a kind of free-form or sparring context. There were two types of punches thrown in the first and no combinations were thrown. A single right cross was thrown repeatedly then the occassional left roundhouse was robotically put in place. (does anyone here who actually fights lead with a right cross?) Then the kick defenses were against the same weak front and side kicks over and over that weren't set up with a hand combination.
EVERY MARTIAL ART HAS SELF DEFENSE MERIT. This was obviously just a demo of techniques. But as I said if you are trying to prove a point about how effective it is, show me footage against an opponent who isn't moving like a zombie performing a kata and someone who is dynamically attacking.

Police military whatever dont use or reccomend them because they are not restraint or killing arts more a make em fall down get away type deal.The aim of police is restrain cart em off to jail and the military to kill.
Chin na[chinese ju jutsu] is used by the FORMOSA police and is usually studied by some tai chi/ba gua adepts for restraint purposes.

Because these arts are not well known especially ba gua or hsing yi a sister art many phonys both asian and western advertise they teach it as no one is likely to know the difference giving the art a bad name.

Demos such as this don't really prove effectiveness but if formed into a practice drill where either side has the opportunity to win if one makes a mistake then it could be a valuable training excercise.

Great isn't it. I know a few guys who train Ba-Gua and they are great to train with. Tai chi is a fantastic martial art.
I'm 6'4" and fairly well built, trained in many styles for 21 years but when I fought an old hippy who had done Ba-gua all his life he just amazed me. its the simplicity of it. He knew so many dirty little tricks, pinching certain points, distractions, fluidity and grace that made attacking him like hitting water. He wasn't a hard looking guy, he took his fluid philosophy into all his life and lives stress free, that's what tai chi dose. Embodys the Tao

Not one military teaches them(doesn't that explain it?).
The other guy is just punching through like some amateur. They can't let a boxer's jab slide through because it comes right back. Also, you can catch an amateur's kick, but if you catch a kick boxer or a Muay Thai fighter's kick, you'll break your hands, fingers, or ribs.

The techniques Master Wong is doing are the movements of his arts.

Just like when I post that you must learn the movements of your kata or else you are not learning the complete teaching of your art.

The greatest Bodyguards in Chinese history were Bagua, Xingyi and Taiji experts.

Not bad, its kind of like what we do, very circular and an inner power oriented style. We train internal AND external, circular AND sraight to overcome people trying to observe your weak points due to habit. Please dont think i am slagging it off, it is really good and efective. For example, boxing can be effective but i like to use my feet- thats metorforically speaking. Thank you for sharing this :)